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Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:59 am
by Cudedog
I actually finished all major construction on the van... [drum roll, please] yesterday, August 16, 2013. I started the project on or about October 1 of last year. There are still bits and pieces that need finish work, but I will get to these as time permits. Today I will cut the foam for the mattresses/beds, and then get out the sewing machine to make the bed coverings and pillows and whatever else.

Should be a fun-filled day using a barely functional sewing machine. I can't wait.

Planning/hoping to attend the West Coast GTG on September 21.

Uhm [clearing throat] anyway, I am getting ahead of myself here. Back to my story:

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This is how most of my days started: a 4 x 8 styrofoam panel laid out on my garage floor that needed to be measured, then measured again, then measured a third time, then cut (my measurements were nearly always wrong, even after three tries - but I got better with the tape measure as time went on). Styrofoam "crumbs" flying everywhere - I always wore a mask and goggles. And discovered the benefits of foam knee pads right quick.

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Here is a photo showing how the ribs of the van are (were) hollow. In doing the conversion, everything I read said that one needed to fill every little nook and cranny with insulation. How to get insulation into the ribs?

Styrofoam beads (think bean bag chair) of course! I am a genius!!

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Or maybe not so much. :o These beads come with a small static charge - so they went everywhere, and stuck to everything. Fingers, hair, clothes. . . when I say everything, I mean everything. EXCEPT it was almost impossible to get them into the holes in the ribs. Oh, no. They didn't want to go there.

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Out the van, down the driveway, and around the block. Think windy day. . . That oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico ain't got nuthin' on me.

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What to do? After two days or so of trying to fill up the ribs with the beads (16 hours or so wasted), pretty much without success, a light dawned. I needed a special tool! I put on my thinking cap, and this is what I came up with:

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Quit snickering. It isn't what you might think. What this is is a tube of hard plastic held closed with duct tape. I looked around in my wood pile for just the right stick, and voila! It works kind of like a miniature (very miniature!) hydraulic ram. Withdraw the stick almost to the end, but leaving the stick in the end of the tube to block the end. Fill tube with styrofoam beads. Insert tube into hole in van ribs. Push stick through plastic tube, beads (mostly) go into rib. Repeat. Starting at the bottom and filling to the first hole, then sealing that hole (or the beads would just leak out again), then going to the next hole above it. Etc. Still very slow, but it worked.

Here is a close-up of what I call the driver's-side header (unfortunately for me, there is also the passenger side header and the header over the rear doors). See all the holes and spaces? All of this needed to be filled with styrofoam beads, or small chunks of the styrofoam panels I was using. Every nook and cranny needed to be filled. Stuffed tight. It took days, which means weeks for me, because I could only work on the van on weekends.

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You will also notice that I very carefully sealed all of the joinings of the styrofoam with duct tape. This took an entire weekend. BIG mistake, that. When I looked into the van a few days later to admire my handiwork and give myself a pat on the back, I was not happy to see that most of the duct tape had come unstuck and was hanging in strips. Who would have thought? So it all needed to be carefully removed (the bits that were still stuck would pull away with styrofoam).

What happened next is for Part III

To be continued. . . details at 11:00. . . or something. . . :roll:

Anne

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 12:02 pm
by BarbaraRose
Wow, what a frustrating project!

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 12:05 pm
by VickieP
It may be a little late now, but what about using the cans of spray in foam?

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 12:52 pm
by havingfunnow
Everybody goes on about duct tape, but I've always found it waaaay too responsive to climate changes. Did you use packing tape or strapping tape in the end?

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 1:38 pm
by JoanE
VickieP wrote:It may be a little late now, but what about using the cans of spray in foam?


Or blown insulation like they do in homes?

You are either courageous or crazy to tackle this project. I would not know where to begin not to mention my impatience at just wanting to be on the road already. The process will be interesting to watch. Keep on keeping on. :D

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:16 pm
by Cudedog
Hello.

Thank you for your responses.

BarbaraRose:

Not really too frustrating. Just longer than I ever thought possible it would take. I figured I would be on the road by spring. Wrong. I didn't even have the insulation finished by then.

I spend 8 hours a day in front of a computer at my job, and I like to do physical stuff (as opposed to sitting for 8 hours) and I also like to work with my hands. This job was just more to chew than I had teeth. Grew some new ones during the process, though! Which is still ongoing. . . but the end is in sight. Finally.

VickieP:

I did tons of research before starting this project. I looked into the spray-on foam insulation (sounded good), but ruled it out because:

1. Once it cures the only way it can then be removed is with sandpaper. Or maybe a hammer and chisel. So you for sure don't want to get it on your hands.

2. It "outgasses". The advertising says not, but the actual can said that it does. Had to borrow a microscope to read the fine print on the can.

3. The stuff expands once it leaves the can in unpredictable ways - and for someone with no experience using it (me) I could see doing a shot or two and having the stuff suddenly expand out the back of the van to bubble down the street.

4. If it expands in a limited space (say inside the ribs of the van) it can deform the metal it is trapped inside as it expands. Strong stuff.

havingfunnow:

I actually ended up using Tyvek tape. It is a tape (made by Dupont) that is designed precisely for building applications (like taping the seams of house wrap paper, or the seams of styrofoam panels), is very strong, sticks really well, and was about the same price - or even a bit less - than the duct tape. it worked really really well. Wish I woulda known about it in advance!

JoanE:

I looked into blown insulation as well, but it had a few problems:

1. It is made from recycled stuff (paper, mostly) and is very absorbent. You don't want something that readily absorbs moisture behind the paneled walls of a vehicle. Metal walls don't breathe like a house does. Moisture will get back there whatever you do. Once this stuff is wet, it will never dry.

2. It is loose. Has to be, so that is can be "blown in". Think about putting finely shredded paper in a small container and shaking it up and down for a few hundred or so times. What was once loose and fluffy filling the container will now be packed at the bottom. A vehicle is always in motion, always bouncing. Loose stuff would settle at the bottom inside the wall, sooner or later. Probably sooner. Then walls would no longer be insulated.

_________

I really did my homework on this, but, being inexperienced there was a LOT that I still missed, or just didn't know about. Styrofoam panels are stiff, they don't "settle" and (this is very important) they *do not* absorb moisture. They were (relatively) easy to work with, although messy. But the "crumbs" were easy to vacuum up.

Thanks, everyone.

Anne

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 4:56 pm
by BirdbyBird
Anne, thanks for sharing your research and learning curve. :)

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 5:19 pm
by grammynmaggie
You are doing great...the van I had was all ready insulated had pink stuff
and it was all finished inside walls ..with vinyl..looking back now...wish I would
have kept it...instead of using it for trade in...although they gave me good deal
cant wait to see the next segment...donna ;)

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:16 am
by Liz
Enjoyed seeing the progress and reading your humorous account. Hope things go smoothly from here.

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:03 pm
by grandmaverick
I missed Part I. What kind of van are you working with. I am purchasing a Ram Promaster 3500. It should have been delivered by now but not. I will have 160 inches long, 73 inches wide and 6 foot 3 inches tall to work with. I will have some help but all the info I can get will be much appreciated. Grand Maverick.

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:14 pm
by Bethers
grandmaverick wrote:I missed Part I. What kind of van are you working with. I am purchasing a Ram Promaster 3500. It should have been delivered by now but not. I will have 160 inches long, 73 inches wide and 6 foot 3 inches tall to work with. I will have some help but all the info I can get will be much appreciated. Grand Maverick.

If you look through the Show of your Rigs section you can find all her various posts - here's her part III:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11114&p=145952#p145952

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 3:08 am
by Cudedog
grandmaverick wrote:I missed Part I. What kind of van are you working with. I am purchasing a Ram Promaster 3500. It should have been delivered by now but not. I will have 160 inches long, 73 inches wide and 6 foot 3 inches tall to work with. I will have some help but all the info I can get will be much appreciated. Grand Maverick.


Hello! Sorry for the late response, and thank you for your interest.

My van is your basic (and I do mean basic!) right-off-the-lot GMC Savana cargo van. It is about six feet wide (inside) and about 20 feet long, bumper-to-bumper. I think. Have not measured it nose-to-tail, but have measured it side-to-side inside the van. Maybe I will put a tape measure on it tomorrow.

I finished the basic build in August of this year (2013) and have created a blog about my DIY construction "adventures":
http://www.heartdogs.net/wordpress
work was started on the van in September of 2012. It took me just about a year to do the conversion - all DIY - and I guesstimate that I spent around 500 (five hundred) hours doing the actual work. The reason it took a year's time is because I still work at a five-days-a-week full-time job, so the van was my "weekend warrior" activity.

The "VAN" link (other links there also) is a drop-down menu with links to various stages of construction. Although construction is finished, I have not finished posting the photos of the finishing stages. Hopefully, I will get to that soon.

As you will see on my blog, I have taken a couple of over-nighters already. The van is an absolute joy to drive, handles very easy, easy to back up and otherwise manuver, very comfortable driving with "captains chair" front seats; I have coaxed 19 mpg highway out of it fully loaded. I plan to take more extended trips in the spring - but since I live in California, where winter weather is pretty moderate compared to the rest of the country, I will take a few winter trips as well.

I installed a small window-type ac unit for those hot summer days; for winter camping I have a small oil-filled radiator type heater.

I plan to do a bit of "off roading" with it (dirt U. S. Forest Service roads that I will use to travel to the volcanoes I am interested in) and it's relatively small size (although it seems huge to me!) makes it perfect for this.

If you have questions, please ask. I LOVE to talk about my van!

Anne

Re: Photos of my van conversion - Part II

PostPosted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:34 am
by grandmaverick
I had a GMC Savana for several years. My husband was in a wheelchair. We put insulation, paneling and electric (110) in it. We let down the back (3rd seat) and extended the remainder of the back area with a iron bed frame, plywood (3 pieces) and pillows (3). He had a catheter and I used an x gallon ice cream pot. We had a cooler that worked on 12V & 110. It made an excellent "kitchen counter". We traveled to see kin mostly and eat some and slept in it. It finally went belly up. I bought a Jetta after that which I am now selling to my daughter-n-law. I got my new 2014 Ram Promaster which is large. The inside measurements are 73" wide, 160" long and 6'3" tall. Yesterday I put card board boxes where furniture etc are proposed to be. So far, so good. Next I will go the the pro shop and let them help me with the placement of the water tanks, batteries etc. I plan to make this my home with all (or almost all) my goodies in it.

I live in Alabama and plan on traveling in the middle of the USA.. but who knows where I will go once I hit the road. Thanks for the info. Grand Maverick aka Rebecca